Who would you rather play with in RANKED?
I kinda feel like this whole war against toxic players is just caused by random kids finding excuses for a lost game and the only thing they can do is report.
I have been playing competitive video games (when I say competitive ofc I don't mean CS/LCS level) for a good time now and only in LoL players fuss a lot about toxic players. It might have something to do with the average age of the players? I think it has changed through the years.
Anyways as DiamondproX said once:
"Mute a toxic good player and you just have a good player,
Mute a nice bad player and you just have a bad player."
I have been playing competitive video games (when I say competitive ofc I don't mean CS/LCS level) for a good time now and only in LoL players fuss a lot about toxic players. It might have something to do with the average age of the players? I think it has changed through the years.
Anyways as DiamondproX said once:
"Mute a toxic good player and you just have a good player,
Mute a nice bad player and you just have a bad player."
You're the one using kids as an excuse to all bad things you see in league. It's just your catchphrase at this point. Plus, a point could be made that kids are the ones who want the toxicity to stay while grown ups (or just mature people in general) would be the ones complaining.
The fact that "other games" accept negative behaviour is one reason why I like league so much. There is more to videogames than being a douchebag. There's a LOT of people who aren't interested in dealing with negative behaviour and that's part of their fun. People being negative ruins the fun of more people than the fun it creates for one, thus it shouldn't be accepted.
You're just refusing to accept that others can get annoyed by things that may be the norm in other games, and it's ironic because that's a very childish behaviour.
The fact that "other games" accept negative behaviour is one reason why I like league so much. There is more to videogames than being a douchebag. There's a LOT of people who aren't interested in dealing with negative behaviour and that's part of their fun. People being negative ruins the fun of more people than the fun it creates for one, thus it shouldn't be accepted.
You're just refusing to accept that others can get annoyed by things that may be the norm in other games, and it's ironic because that's a very childish behaviour.
Blian wrote:
I kinda feel like this whole war against toxic players is just caused by random kids finding excuses for a lost game and the only thing they can do is report.
I have been playing competitive video games (when I say competitive ofc I don't mean CS/LCS level) for a good time now and only in LoL players fuss a lot about toxic players. It might have something to do with the average age of the players? I think it has changed through the years.
Anyways as DiamondproX said once:
"Mute a toxic good player and you just have a good player,
Mute a nice bad player and you just have a bad player."
I have been playing competitive video games (when I say competitive ofc I don't mean CS/LCS level) for a good time now and only in LoL players fuss a lot about toxic players. It might have something to do with the average age of the players? I think it has changed through the years.
Anyways as DiamondproX said once:
"Mute a toxic good player and you just have a good player,
Mute a nice bad player and you just have a bad player."
And I kinda feel like you're a super toxic player who can't understand that some people are annoyed by your behaviour lmao.
That aside, I'm 19 (so I guess I fall somewhere between 'kid' and 'fully mature') and I never feel any personal offense by toxic players and what they say usually doesn't affect me the slightest bit. However, I do notice that the atmosphere in games worsen when people start voicing negative ****. Muting them only solves a bit of the problem; often they continue in other ways or other players still keep arguing. Once you click mute, the damage has already been done.
Exaggerated anecdote:
If someone were to walk up to a Jew and tell him that he should've died in the gas chambers, who should be the one to adjust his behaviour? Should the Jew just walk away and let the guy be left unpunished, or should we at the very least try to punish and reform the guy saying such things? Even though the Jew should indeed just walk away, you can't just ignore such things and therefore he should be punished, and the same goes for LoL.
It really depends. If the guy is toxic to the point where he tilts the rest of the team, then no, because we are going to lose anyway in that case. However, if the unskilled player can't follow instructions and goes off to die in sidelanes the whole game, then that isn't good either. It isn't really a black and white situation.
That being said, I'm surprised that people who don't enjoy ranked still play it for the sake of getting a better rating. Muting isn't a good solution for toxicity though, it is more of a last resort when the flaming in chat gets too out of hand. By the time you mute someone, the damage is usually done, and it also cuts off anything useful he might say in chat. I do agree that the majority of people could afford to be a bit more thickskinned though. I don't really think people saying things like "yo, group the **** up dude" should be reportable.
Please stop using the word toxic to describe people insulting others over a video game. They are rude and inconsiderate sure, but I highly doubt they go around in real life insulting strangers.
edit: fkin vynert
That being said, I'm surprised that people who don't enjoy ranked still play it for the sake of getting a better rating. Muting isn't a good solution for toxicity though, it is more of a last resort when the flaming in chat gets too out of hand. By the time you mute someone, the damage is usually done, and it also cuts off anything useful he might say in chat. I do agree that the majority of people could afford to be a bit more thickskinned though. I don't really think people saying things like "yo, group the **** up dude" should be reportable.
Please stop using the word toxic to describe people insulting others over a video game. They are rude and inconsiderate sure, but I highly doubt they go around in real life insulting strangers.
edit: fkin vynert
Also I should add that specifically for high Elo (not sure to what extent this goes for lower ratings as well) people have found special ways to be toxic that go way beyond what you can avoid through muting. It ranges from disco Nunu & Willump to ping spam, splitpush, open mid and many, many more.
Nunu & Willump to ping spam, splitpush, open mid and many, many more.
Blian wrote:
Neither do I and I also completely agree on the having fun part. But playing normals or arams is not as much fun as ranked? I do love cheesy builds and picks too or goofing around with my friends but when I play ranked there is always one objective which is the VICTORY.
I enjoy ranked even more than normals and ARAM – hell, I dislike ARAM quite a bit unless I'm intoxicated or something – but the fun for me comes not only from the competitive aspect, but also the chance of constantly being able to improve myself as I am being pit against others of about the same skill level; after all, that's when you should really get a challenge.
However, I don't need a victory screen as confirmation that I generally did a good job; I know what I did wrong and right after every game and take from it what I can. If I happen to lose because a member on my team just had a horrible game and is honest about it, then so be it; **** happens, to all of us. In the end, you're just out one game, and that's it.
Blian wrote:
Maybe MUTE then? I know people love preaching about communication which is a key factor I agree but except really high ELO I think pings would do the trick. I don't think decent/low elo players can take advantage of timing ulties or summs (no offense!).
Once you get to the point where you have to mute a player, well, the damage is done; sure, it can be repaired over time, but honestly, to me, personally, the atmosphere of the game is already ruined. Sure, I'll be glad if I get another win out of it, but if I didn't, then I didn't, who cares?
Ekki wrote:
That said, I don't play soloqueue to have fun. I play to climb and because I like analizing the stats. I guess even then it depends on how toxic/how good the negative player is vs how bad the unskilled player is. I mean, if he's just slightly better than average but starts tilting everyone I'd rather have the polite noob that can follow orders. Now if he's getting really fed and a good chunk of his toxicity falls on the other team (or just on me) then hell yeah I'll take him.
Yeah, but isn't it about personal improvement? I mean, one can easily analyse oneself even if some other member of the team is having a bad game. Also, one match is not going to make a whole lot of difference regarding your overall performance. If we'd state this in an absolute fashion, however, as in, it happens every game, then I'm fairly certain it would no longer be worth the effort.
And yeah, of course, we indeed must understand that there are degrees of bad and degrees of toxic, but I think that we all have a good idea of what the OP means by “toxic” and “unskilled”.
FalseoGod wrote:
I'm on the fence on this one. On one side, "toxicity" is not a straight line and people have different levels of tolerance. I've been called toxic on multiple occasions just because of some funky sass but I can count with one hand the amount of times I was actually aiming for being brutally offensive.
You're just too fabulous for those people.
Blian wrote:
I kinda feel like this whole war against toxic players is just caused by random kids finding excuses for a lost game and the only thing they can do is report.
I have been playing competitive video games (when I say competitive ofc I don't mean CS/LCS level) for a good time now and only in LoL players fuss a lot about toxic players. It might have something to do with the average age of the players? I think it has changed through the years.
Anyways as DiamondproX said once:
"Mute a toxic good player and you just have a good player,
Mute a nice bad player and you just have a bad player."
I have been playing competitive video games (when I say competitive ofc I don't mean CS/LCS level) for a good time now and only in LoL players fuss a lot about toxic players. It might have something to do with the average age of the players? I think it has changed through the years.
Anyways as DiamondproX said once:
"Mute a toxic good player and you just have a good player,
Mute a nice bad player and you just have a bad player."
I kinda feel like this whole war against inexperienced players/players who have a bad game is just caused by random kids finding excuses for a lost game... etcetera. You should get my point here; blaming a loss on a toxic player is no different from blaming it on someone who had a bad game, except that the toxic player is actually doing something that is not socially acceptable.
I think it has everything to do with the fact that online gaming as a whole is maturing, and not with the average age of the players. Up until a few years ago, online gaming wasn't all that normal; more of a fringe group than the bulk of society, as a result, you get a different norm. However, nowadays, especially with a game as popular as LoL, online gaming has become a part of society and its culture, hence it must adhere to its norms and values as well, which is why people tend to take toxic behaviour more seriously.
Regarding that quote: Yeah, but DiamondproX is a pro player, and not just any player, so his quote isn't relevant. DiamondproX plays for more than just fun; it's for a living, for streams, etcetera. He thrives off getting good results, of getting as high as possible on the ladder, and well, it's expected.
Also, we mustn't forget that muting a nice player is an action we wouldn't ever consider, because a positive attitude and atmosphere can really help actually winning a game; I'm not talking about the whole anime-******** that is “friendship conquers all”, but it can definitely make a difference, whereas a toxic player can still manage to lose you the game because of the atmosphere they create or because they simply refuse to cooperate with a team they consider inferior. In short: The quote is not only irrelevant, but also oversimplifies the game in the sense that it does not consider human behaviour to be a variable.
Ekki wrote:
The fact that "other games" accept negative behaviour is one reason why I like league so much. There is more to videogames than being a douchebag. There's a LOT of people who aren't interested in dealing with negative behaviour and that's part of their fun. People being negative ruins the fun of more people than the fun it creates for one, thus it shouldn't be accepted.
Well, and there's the whole culture that essentially implies that in order to be competitive, you should just abandon all social rules and norms, because that means that you truly go for it, which is, obviously, absurd.
H4xDefender wrote:
It really depends. If the guy is toxic to the point where he tilts the rest of the team, then no, because we are going to lose anyway in that case. However, if the unskilled player can't follow instructions and goes off to die in sidelanes the whole game, then that isn't good either. It isn't really a black and white situation.
Fkin H4x, posting whilst I was posting my mega-post. Anyway, obviously it's not a black-and-white situation – for God's sake, it's not America har har har – however, I'd say there are general situations; mostly I would just say that the “unskilled” player isn't as good as the average player in the tier, for example a Diamond V player in a predominantly Diamond I-II game (just an example).
H4xDefender wrote:
That being said, I'm surprised that people who don't enjoy ranked still play it for the sake of getting a better rating. Muting isn't a good solution for toxicity though, it is more of a last resort when the flaming in chat gets too out of hand. By the time you mute someone, the damage is usually done, and it also cuts off anything useful he might say in chat. I do agree that the majority of people could afford to be a bit more thickskinned though. I don't really think people saying things like "yo, group the **** up dude" should be reportable.
Yeah, this is exactly my point; muting isn't a solution, and not even something you want to be doing. I mean, at least it stops you from being distracted by the constant ranting of certain players, but yeah, the damage has been done. Regarding the think-skinned thing, I guess that's fair as occasionally I have seen people who want to report someone for about nothing, but that's a very, very small number of the total playerbase.
Also, yeah, I really do not understand people who play ranked solely for rating.
H4xDefender wrote:
Please stop using the word toxic to describe people insulting others over a video game. They are rude and inconsiderate sure, but I highly doubt they go around in real life insulting strangers.
I think “toxic” is a term that's thrown around loosely; I think we all know what it's supposed to indicate here, although I agree that the term is poorly chosen.
Vynertje wrote:
Also I should add that specifically for high Elo (not sure to what extent this goes for lower ratings as well) people have found special ways to be toxic that go way beyond what you can avoid through muting. It ranges from disco Nunu & Willump to ping spam, splitpush, open mid and many, many more.
Nunu & Willump to ping spam, splitpush, open mid and many, many more.Two words:
Tahm Kench.
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