Yes, I'll just use my skill to magically make minions appear where I'm ulting. It's all so clear to me now.
I don't think he needs nerfs.
The meta shifting were big enough nerfs, even if it was indirect.
Right now if they buff his late game he'll probably become an even bigger issue and people will cry for more nerfs.
The meta shifting were big enough nerfs, even if it was indirect.
Right now if they buff his late game he'll probably become an even bigger issue and people will cry for more nerfs.
Not that his Ult has ALSO the feature to deposition someone. Making an enemy target vulnerable for attacks or peeling them off your mates.
Even while the single parts doesn't seem that much, it's the fact that you have them all together in one ability, giving you the posibility to be creative is what makes it more than just Ali's Headbutt/Vi's Ult or Blitz's grab.
Being able to use it in the right way in a fitting situation is what "skill" means.
And to come back to it for a short moment:
His 2 "in-build Flashes" are ofc not comparable to a real Flash, but being able to use them in a way that you can jump a wall 2 times every 9 secs for example is what makes them dangerous.
Think creative, we aren't talking about simple stats, stuff that is 100% certain, we talk about possibility giving to you by sheer versatility.
Even while the single parts doesn't seem that much, it's the fact that you have them all together in one ability, giving you the posibility to be creative is what makes it more than just Ali's Headbutt/Vi's Ult or Blitz's grab.
Being able to use it in the right way in a fitting situation is what "skill" means.
And to come back to it for a short moment:
His 2 "in-build Flashes" are ofc not comparable to a real Flash, but being able to use them in a way that you can jump a wall 2 times every 9 secs for example is what makes them dangerous.
Think creative, we aren't talking about simple stats, stuff that is 100% certain, we talk about possibility giving to you by sheer versatility.
Found an interesting quote at the wiki:
Emptylord:
The reduction to his early game isn't as severe as you say. The change from bonus AD to total AD is a substantial buff to his per-level scaling across all his skill.
Factoring his base AD and assuming you're maxing Q first, his Q deals 45 / 74 / 105 / 138 / 171 (+50 / 60 / 70 / 80 / 90 % bonus AD) (+2.88 per level thereafter). This is nerf of 5 / 6 / 5 / 2 / -1 (+40 / 30 / 20 / 10 / 0 % bonus AD) damage.
The only nerf to his early game is execution damage on his Resonating Strike, but this scales up to normal (or rather, comparable) by rank 4/5. Physical damage instead of magic damage on his Tempest will possibly hurt his AOE clearing in the jungle. In fact, the only actual nerf here is the change to Safeguard's cost - and that's an all-game nerf. At the moment he's practically identical 1-9, and from 9-18 he just gets stronger.
Quoted:
Emptylord:
The reduction to his early game isn't as severe as you say. The change from bonus AD to total AD is a substantial buff to his per-level scaling across all his skill.
Factoring his base AD and assuming you're maxing Q first, his Q deals 45 / 74 / 105 / 138 / 171 (+50 / 60 / 70 / 80 / 90 % bonus AD) (+2.88 per level thereafter). This is nerf of 5 / 6 / 5 / 2 / -1 (+40 / 30 / 20 / 10 / 0 % bonus AD) damage.
The only nerf to his early game is execution damage on his Resonating Strike, but this scales up to normal (or rather, comparable) by rank 4/5. Physical damage instead of magic damage on his Tempest will possibly hurt his AOE clearing in the jungle. In fact, the only actual nerf here is the change to Safeguard's cost - and that's an all-game nerf. At the moment he's practically identical 1-9, and from 9-18 he just gets stronger.
Not to say that I agree with Nickname in any given way... (No! Dear god, NO!)
But as the quote states: Excluding some tweaking here and there, if they keep the course of changes it's quite possible that they will him nerf even more, since his early wasn't hit THAT hard compared to his late buff.
But as the quote states: Excluding some tweaking here and there, if they keep the course of changes it's quite possible that they will him nerf even more, since his early wasn't hit THAT hard compared to his late buff.
Calculation goes on:
Okay, for now we use ad marks and quints and 9/21/0 masteries. This leads for Lee to 79 AD at level 1, 20 of that is bonus AD.
Tempest:
Old: 60 (+100% bonus AD). => 60+20 = 80
New: 25 / 50 / 75 / 100 / 125 (+60% total AD) => 25+79*0.6 = 72.4
That is 7.6 damage, and not only that, if you don't max it first, the damage increases due to the base AD gain. The increase is 1.92 per level, means it deals the same damage at level 4.
Okay, for now we use ad marks and quints and 9/21/0 masteries. This leads for Lee to 79 AD at level 1, 20 of that is bonus AD.
Tempest:Old: 60 (+100% bonus AD). => 60+20 = 80
New: 25 / 50 / 75 / 100 / 125 (+60% total AD) => 25+79*0.6 = 72.4
That is 7.6 damage, and not only that, if you don't max it first, the damage increases due to the base AD gain. The increase is 1.92 per level, means it deals the same damage at level 4.
tbh i think the only thing that needed a nerf was his safeguard, but the change they made doesnt really make sense, maybe a CD nerf and something like 60-70 energy cost
also i think his sustain should be taken down a bit, once he gets hydra he can go from low hp to full from one camp because of his built in lifesteal but thats just me
also i think his sustain should be taken down a bit, once he gets hydra he can go from low hp to full from one camp because of his built in lifesteal but thats just me
Thanks to TheNamelessBard for the signature
I think the worst part about this is knowing that lee sin's win rate is 48% with generally more losses than wins in nearly every single division. And Riot is looking for some nerfs on him instead of looking at the top 5: Wukong (55%), Ziggs (54%), Kayle (Still dominating at 54%), Amumu (54%), and Sivir (53%).
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seriously---
Hey kiddo,
it's simply what I would call "skill dependable".
But I guess that's to much for someone who thinks abusing his Ult as a point and click burst is ok.
Better go and train how to plant your wards so you can point and click Safeguard them.