7.4 Tier List + AMA

[quote=FalseoGod]I agree that his early is when he is the weakest by far. He has a pretty short mana pool so he can't abuse the passive. But midgame onwards he stops having cooldowns, he can assist your frontliner from miles away while providing CC and peel. As long as you have mana you can continuously rotate through his kit and apply passive.[/quote]

[quote=H4xDefender]I think at lower elos he isn't too broken, but I guarantee if hes enabled for pro play he will be 100% p/b in this status or very close to it. He doesn't even need to do anything except survive in lane, and he wins you the game by himself later if the ult is used properly. Sivir/Taric both pressing R and engaging is so dirty.[/quote]

[quote=Vapora Dark]When does MSI start? I assume he will be enabled in time for MSI because I imagine they're wanting to shake up the meta with the mages rework for MSI the same way they shook it up with Juggernauts for Worlds, so MSI would therefore be played on the 6.9 patch. He'd be nerfed, but [[taric]] would definitely be enabled for pro play at that point.[/quote]

[quote=The_Nameless_Bard][quote=H4xDefender]I think at lower elos he isn't too broken[/quote]In low Elo people just have no idea how to play him, as expected.[/quote]

[quote=Vynertje][quote=Vapora Dark]When does MSI start? I assume he will be enabled in time for MSI because I imagine they're wanting to shake up the meta with the mages rework for MSI the same way they shook it up with Juggernauts for Worlds, so MSI would therefore be played on the 6.9 patch. He'd be nerfed, but [[taric]] would definitely be enabled for pro play at that point.[/quote] 4th of may iirc, so i think he will be enabled[/quote]

[quote=H4xDefender][quote=Vapora Dark]When does MSI start? I assume he will be enabled in time for MSI because I imagine they're wanting to shake up the meta with the mages rework for MSI the same way they shook it up with Juggernauts for Worlds, so MSI would therefore be played on the 6.9 patch. He'd be nerfed, but [[taric]] would definitely be enabled for pro play at that point.[/quote] May 4-15. Should almost definitely be 6.8, but I'm unsure about taric. I'm going to assume he'll be enabled. The thing about his ultimate is that, even if you get a lot of damage out early in a teamfight, if you aren't confident you can finish key targets off before the ultimate goes off, you have to start leaving, and that is 4-5 seconds of just not fighting the enemy team, which is often disastrous. Most champions in the meta right now just don't burst that hard, and as a result the ultimate is super game changing. Not to mention it isn't like kindred ultimate, where you can't be healed while in its effect. A maokai can literally jump in like an idiot, have taric ult channel get started, survive just 2.5 seconds, and then heal about half of his health from grasp/passive/taric heal while invulnerable, and then go back in to eat another full rotation of cooldowns. It isn't balanced in the slightest, and that isn't even considering how good his stun is at getting picks.[/quote]

[quote=MungoGeri][quote=H4xDefender][quote=Vapora Dark]When does MSI start? I assume he will be enabled in time for MSI because I imagine they're wanting to shake up the meta with the mages rework for MSI the same way they shook it up with Juggernauts for Worlds, so MSI would therefore be played on the 6.9 patch. He'd be nerfed, but [[taric]] would definitely be enabled for pro play at that point.[/quote] May 4-15. Should almost definitely be 6.8, but I'm unsure about taric. I'm going to assume he'll be enabled. The thing about his ultimate is that, even if you get a lot of damage out early in a teamfight, if you aren't confident you can finish key targets off before the ultimate goes off, you have to start leaving, and that is 4-5 seconds of just not fighting the enemy team, which is often disastrous. Most champions in the meta right now just don't burst that hard, and as a result the ultimate is super game changing. Not to mention it isn't like kindred ultimate, where you can't be healed while in its effect. A maokai can literally jump in like an idiot, have taric ult channel get started, survive just 2.5 seconds, and then heal about half of his health from grasp/passive/taric heal while invulnerable, and then go back in to eat another full rotation of cooldowns. It isn't balanced in the slightest, and that isn't even considering how good his stun is at getting picks.[/quote] Making people invulnerable to heals would be an interesting way to nerf some of the power of the ult for sure. I'm not impressed with the stun's ability to get picks, though. There are lots of other champions who have stronger cc capabilities than that. His only other peel option is [[iceborn gauntlet]] or [[frozen mallet]]. Luckily at high CDR, he can rotate his spells to retrigger the [[iceborn gauntlet]] passive pretty consistently, but otherwise his peel is pretty weak compared to other tank supports.[/quote]

[quote=Vapora Dark][quote=MungoGeri][quote=H4xDefender][quote=Vapora Dark]When does MSI start? I assume he will be enabled in time for MSI because I imagine they're wanting to shake up the meta with the mages rework for MSI the same way they shook it up with Juggernauts for Worlds, so MSI would therefore be played on the 6.9 patch. He'd be nerfed, but [[taric]] would definitely be enabled for pro play at that point.[/quote] May 4-15. Should almost definitely be 6.8, but I'm unsure about taric. I'm going to assume he'll be enabled. The thing about his ultimate is that, even if you get a lot of damage out early in a teamfight, if you aren't confident you can finish key targets off before the ultimate goes off, you have to start leaving, and that is 4-5 seconds of just not fighting the enemy team, which is often disastrous. Most champions in the meta right now just don't burst that hard, and as a result the ultimate is super game changing. Not to mention it isn't like kindred ultimate, where you can't be healed while in its effect. A maokai can literally jump in like an idiot, have taric ult channel get started, survive just 2.5 seconds, and then heal about half of his health from grasp/passive/taric heal while invulnerable, and then go back in to eat another full rotation of cooldowns. It isn't balanced in the slightest, and that isn't even considering how good his stun is at getting picks.[/quote] I'm not impressed with the stun's ability to get picks, though. There are lots of other champions who have stronger cc capabilities than that.[/quote] But none of them get to cast that CC from a mile away through one of their team-mates. The fact that you have to look out for a possible stun from a [[teemo]] is pretty crazy.[/quote]

[quote=DillButt64]zed with a stun is nice[/quote]

[quote=PsiGuard][quote=H4xDefender]Not to mention it isn't like kindred ultimate[/quote] Speaking of which, Kindred ult is already a giant pain to deal with in competitive team fights (in some cases, allowing a Kindred to solo-tank 2-3 enemies on one side of the fight while their team deals with the remainder). With Taric ult at the end of a Kindred ult, you can virtually guarantee your team wins any fight where both teams have members that are at the 10% threshold, since 2.5s is easily long enough to clean up anyone that was low (also gives you time to heal after the kindred ult expires). Unless his laning is garbage or something, I'd expect him to see play.[/quote]